29ers
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2226
Printed Date: 18 Aug 25 at 5:45am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: 29ers
Posted By: mike ellis
Subject: 29ers
Date Posted: 19 Sep 06 at 7:15pm
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just been reminded by the thread on 600s at the moment.... where have all the 29ers gone??????? i cant find any for sale anywhere at all apart from one that has been advertised in april and has gone. ive tried all the normal places, class website, appolo duck, boatsandoutboards, y+y classifieds, local club noticeboards. there are none going anywhere. can anyone help me out?? oh and while we're on this topic does anyone know anyone who wants a second hand feva with a new hull (the old one broke and LDC are very kind) newish mast, 1 old main, 1 new main, 3 jibs one of which is new and 1 kite. has launching trolley, top cover and mast bag. asking £2,600 but will accept a reasonable offer. PM if you know anyone who is interested. ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Replies:
Posted By: 29er397
Date Posted: 19 Sep 06 at 7:29pm
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have you looked at DSM? mine was in there but got snapped up pretty quickly. When you think about it, its not suprising there is less on the market, factoring in that it is the 2007 isaf youth boat, and the launch of the xx. From my selling experiance i think you have to ring up with intent to buy the boat, put down a deposite or organise a viewing, this will usually mean that the seller will not sell the boat untill you have viewed it and made your decision. Also, if you put a deposite down, you can in effect reserve the boat untill you have viewed it, if it isnt up to its description, give the seller a mouthfull and take your money back. ------------- http://www.kielderwatersc.org - Kielder Water Sailing Club |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 19 Sep 06 at 7:55pm
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havent tried DSM yet, thanks for the tip. ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: Prince Buster
Date Posted: 19 Sep 06 at 8:48pm
I'm looking for one too mike, so if you find a site with any for sale please tell me about it too ------------- international moth - "what what?" |
Posted By: Skiffman
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 12:38pm
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There are hardly any if sale if any at all because all the topper national squad, 420s, oppys etc are all moving into the 29er and buying up all the boats. To give you an idea 2 boats have been sold in the past couple of weeks and both sold as soon as they told anybody they were for sale. Also Ovington are churning out a 29er a day up at the factory and theres a 3 month waiting list!!! Its great if you have one and want to sell it because the prices have shot up. What you need to do is if you see any at a club ask the owner if they want to sell it, there are over 400 29ers in GBR and there arnt 400 on the racing circuit. ------------- 49er GBR5 http://www.teamfletcherandsign.co.uk - teamfletcherandsign.co.uk Team Fletcher and Sign campaign site |
Posted By: vagoowner
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 1:18pm
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you need to go to http://www.rya-online.net/29er - www.rya-online.net/29er there are about 10 on there |
Posted By: vagoowner
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 1:19pm
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correction - sorry - its http://www.homepages.rya-online.net/29er/ - www.homepages.rya-online.net/29er/
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Posted By: vagoowner
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 1:21pm
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and that doesn't work either! 3rd time lucky - no wonder no-one knows about it http://homepages.rya-online.net/29er/need_a_boat.htm - http://homepages.rya-online.net/29er/need_a_boat.htm |
Posted By: Skiffman
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 7:39pm
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Thats because its like 5 years old!!!! ------------- 49er GBR5 http://www.teamfletcherandsign.co.uk - teamfletcherandsign.co.uk Team Fletcher and Sign campaign site |
Posted By: Prince Buster
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 8:03pm
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really? are none of those for sale anymore then?
------------- international moth - "what what?" |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 8:21pm
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how do you know its so old skiffman? ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: I luv Wight
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 9:55pm
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when I was looking for one in June, i emailed most of them on that site , and any replies I had said the boat was sold.... years ago!
But one guy said that his mate still had his, not used due to kids etc, and might be selling.... and now i've got one! 
www.sailingimages.co.uk |
Posted By: 29er397
Date Posted: 20 Sep 06 at 9:58pm
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i get the feeling i should have put mine on ebay, then you lot could hav made me millions!
------------- http://www.kielderwatersc.org - Kielder Water Sailing Club |
Posted By: Blobby
Date Posted: 21 Sep 06 at 1:25am
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If there are 2 of you looking try http://www.skiffasia.com - www.skiffasia.com - they seem to be selling their 29ers at the moment. OK you need to organise a container over to the UK but the boats are in perfect nick and hardly been used... ------------- One step forwards, 2 steps back... |
Posted By: squeek
Date Posted: 25 Sep 06 at 9:53pm
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hi BOAT NOW SOLD ------------- 29er GBR 29 |
Posted By: Blobby
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 1:17am
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Why do people bother putting "fast boat" in an ad for SMODs? ------------- One step forwards, 2 steps back... |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 9:05am
'Cos no-one really believes that they are all identical I suppose... |
Posted By: Chris Turner
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 12:37pm
| Another good source of secondhand 29er's is to contact Dave Hall @ mailto:niners@ovingtonboats.co.uk - niners@ovingtonboats.co.uk Dave attends most events and often takes boats in part exchange. The current delivery time for new boats is 6 weeks. |
Posted By: CT249
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 1:59pm
It's called "salesmanship", I suppose. And it implies you lift it onto the cradle rather than just connecting it to a 4wd and dragging it over the oysters, etc. It's human nature to talk bull about things isn't it? I've seen people saying how a heavy, scratched and leaky 1977 Laser is really a super-fast boat because that year they had 3mm less hollow aft of the bailer. Strangely such people decline to swap their own new boats for said '77 bucket when the offer is made, illustrating that there's a difference between what they say and what they truly believe. Having said that, SMODs like Lasers and Tasars here get zero premium from dealers (or anyone else I know) for having a championship winning race record. |
Posted By: squeek
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 6:00pm
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it has a good track record and has been well looked after and in good condition...hence the ''fast boat'' has come 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th at uk events, 5th, 8th, at european events as well as 29th at world champs soph ------------- 29er GBR 29 |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 7:20pm
£5500 sounds like a lot for a second hand boat . that cant be far off a new one can it?------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: Prince Buster
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 7:46pm
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yeah it really does sound a lot! And for a boat that old, 029!! I'm not sure what the exact number they're up to now but i know it's in the thousands. So why the high price Sophie?? What's special about it? ------------- international moth - "what what?" |
Posted By: CurlyBen
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 7:52pm
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I think all the numbers below 50 are reserved, it's number 029 because it was 29th at the worlds...
------------- RS800 GBR848 Weston SC |
Posted By: squeek
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 7:58pm
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in 9ers the top 50 boats at the world champs get their world ranking as their sail number eg it came 29th at the worlds. the actually boats sail number is GBR 342!! so it's not ancient! sorry for the comfusion! the boats has ben completly stripped and refitted in the last 8 months so all thats left of the old is the hull and spinnaker pole! 9er hulls dont go soft with age and it all of 20 grams more than the minimum hull weight! soph ------------- 29er GBR 29 |
Posted By: I luv Wight
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 8:55pm
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342 = 2001?
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Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 8:59pm
so you say. ------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 9:10pm
And that's the bit of 29ers I most regularly have to repair! |
Posted By: Prince Buster
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 9:20pm
Spill Sparrow, do they deteriorate with age? Go soft? ------------- international moth - "what what?" |
Posted By: 29er397
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 9:28pm
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all hulls deteriorate with age,some more than others, but i doubt Ovingtons has got a worldwide reputation for nothing!
------------- http://www.kielderwatersc.org - Kielder Water Sailing Club |
Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 9:28pm
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They are polyester. Well made polyester even so. Be interesting to see
how they stand up to the 'XX' package. ------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 9:29pm
It would be suprising if a polyester boat didn't eventually go soft, (and preumably an epoxy one if you give it long enough) but they're pretty well engineered, so you'd expect them to last longer than those classes which use csm and/or where the loads are less well distributed into the structure. I suspect that boats go out of use more often because they end up in the brambles at the back of dinghy parks than because they go terminally soft actually... Imagine a 29er that's been left unattended for three years or so in the brambles, sails eaten by mice, the blocks and strings probably worn out anyway, the fibre parts of the spars disaapearing into fuzz under UV... It may not have gone soft, but its still going to cost a fortune to resurrect and likely to end up on the tip... |
Posted By: Skiffman
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 9:46pm
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The hulls last a long time, and people call them fast boats because they feel faster than other boats. We had 2 boats one made in 2002 and the other in 2005, they both felt quick. But we always used the 2002 as a training boat and therefore with an old mast but we were still very quick in it. In fact looking back on it now it was going very fast at the last squad training before the worlds. The newer boat was kept for big events only, and we used it at the worlds this year. With our older boat made in 2002 we chartered it to another team at the worlds. Both boats were weighed at the worlds the old boat being 1.5kg underweight and the new boat was 2.9kg overweight!!!! Which was a shock! By the end of the worlds our old boat beat us (1st and 2nd), but it was sailed my very good sailors. So the age of the boat does not matter if the boat is set-up, down to weight and sailed by the right sailors. ------------- 49er GBR5 http://www.teamfletcherandsign.co.uk - teamfletcherandsign.co.uk Team Fletcher and Sign campaign site |
Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 26 Sep 06 at 9:56pm
That's hardly a big age gap. I'd hope that 3 years wouldn't make a difference. ------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: Blobby
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 2:49am
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What with my 29er being the first one into Singapore, Julian Bethwaite being at the ISAF conference at the time and in his words "being anal about making sure the first boats in a set up right" I got to spend 1/2 a day with Julian getting my boat set up correctly. Some of the pearls of wisdom - 29ers get lighter with age and the only problem you may get in time is the ply frames in the hull rotting out if you don't take both bungs out when not being used. Having a good track record of event wins only means the monkeys in the boat were fast - not the boat itself. ------------- One step forwards, 2 steps back... |
Posted By: Skiffman
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 9:45am
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I have never ever found that a 29er gets lighter with age, generally they get heavier. Especially if they leak then it seems the the polyester resin soaks up the water. No offence to Julian I just do not like him ------------- 49er GBR5 http://www.teamfletcherandsign.co.uk - teamfletcherandsign.co.uk Team Fletcher and Sign campaign site |
Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 10:40am
Well he's quite good at marketing the Bethwaite name, isn't he. ------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: 49erGBR735HSC
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 10:44am
I think proof to Julian's theory may be observed through your statement that your older boat was lighter than your newer boat. A sligthly educated guess would be that Julian was reckoning that the boats got lighter with time due to the fact that the polyester was given more heat exposure and time to cure. From a marketing point of view its quite bad to say that older boats get lighter with time unless there was some meaning behind it because it would be encouraging people to look for older boats that were lighter instead of buying boats straight out of the factory. Regardless of personality, it doesn't necesarily mean someone is wrong (although I can't comment on personality because I've never met the guy). ------------- Dennis Watson 49er GBR735 http://www.helensburghsailingclub.co.uk/ - Helensburgh S.C http://www.noblemarine.co.uk/home.php3?affid=560 - Boat Insurance from Noble Marine |
Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 10:47am
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Oh come on, bad marketing to say a boat gets lighter with age. ------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: Granite
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 7:30pm
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The lighter with age thing could mean that they are being built heavier now! interesting to hear that they use plywood bulkheads that would make me wary of one that had sailed on fresh water and sat for some time.
------------- If it doesn't break it's too heavy; if it does it wasn't built right |
Posted By: m_liddell
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 7:44pm
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Polymers are pretty good at moisture takeup = heavier boat |
Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 7:54pm
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3kg over weight? You could get that back by wearing a thinner wetsuit or drinking less water before the race! Hardly think it significantly affects performance. |
Posted By: timnoyce
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 8:03pm
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dynamic weight isn't as bad as dead weight in the boat though.
------------- http://www.facebook.com/bearfootdesign - BEARFOOT DESIGN Cherub 2648 - Comfortably Numb |
Posted By: m_liddell
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 8:54pm
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Truth. Dynamic weight = more righting moment. |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 10:43pm
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my crew (sister) has rejected me and wants a laser now. so im not going to get laser incase she beats me in it. im now going to spend the next 6 months swimming whilst learning to sail a 600, if i can get one. ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: timnoyce
Date Posted: 27 Sep 06 at 10:48pm
rejection by a sister.... harsh times 
------------- http://www.facebook.com/bearfootdesign - BEARFOOT DESIGN Cherub 2648 - Comfortably Numb |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 28 Sep 06 at 12:37am
Plenty of Cherub Champs were won with boats that much over in the days of plywood and aerolite when the min weight was a bit aspirational for most builders. |
Posted By: Granite
Date Posted: 28 Sep 06 at 4:01pm
Do you really drink 3 liters of water before you go sailing? When you know you have just taken 3kg of lead or other weightout of the boat you can feel the difference but that could be psycological ------------- If it doesn't break it's too heavy; if it does it wasn't built right |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 28 Sep 06 at 6:47pm
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i know, apparently i shout too much, dont know how we have sailed together for 2 years allready. ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: Hector
Date Posted: 13 Dec 06 at 2:44pm
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http://sailingdinghies.apolloduck.co.uk/display.phtml?aid=52163 - http://sailingdinghies.apolloduck.co.uk/display.phtml?aid=52 163
|
Posted By: Noble Marine
Date Posted: 13 Dec 06 at 3:17pm
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There's a 29er listed at http://www.noblemarine.co.uk/boatsforsale/boat/11867/ - www.noblemarine.co.uk/boatsforsale/boat/11867/ ------------- http://www.noblemarine.co.uk" rel="nofollow - Boat Insurance from Noble Marine http://www.facebook.com/noblemarine" rel="nofollow - Noble Marine on Facebook . |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 13 Dec 06 at 3:54pm
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thanks for your help but i got a laser a in october. despite what lots of people say the boat isnt that bad. and i dont see why everyone has hiking shorts, it doesnt hurt. ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: Isis
Date Posted: 13 Dec 06 at 3:57pm
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If hiking doesnt hurt then your either a far fitter guy than me or you aint hinking hard enough...
------------- |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 13 Dec 06 at 4:27pm
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it hurts afterwards, but not when im hiking. and i dont see how hikers would help because its not as if the side deck digs into you thigh ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: Adds
Date Posted: 13 Dec 06 at 5:06pm
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praps hikers would stop your legs from hurting afterwards!!! ------------- Cheers Dudes |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 13 Dec 06 at 7:57pm
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i have a tight toestrap all the time because i havent worked out how to adjust them on the water yet. i get the pain in my thighs and backside not in the joints so i reckon im ok. ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: CT249
Date Posted: 18 Dec 06 at 11:30am
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The hiking pants means your thigh muscles don't compress over the gunwale, so you actually lift an inch or so. If you are sailing the boat in rough water at the correct angle of heel, that inch is important. It also improves blood flow. If I remember rightly, both these points were made during the research that earned the current World champ his PhD in Sports Science. People who don't have to work hard to stop their bum dragging are normally sailing with too much heel. |