Racing Rules: Future of RRS 17

Future of RRS 17

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Category: General
Forum Name: Racing Rules
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URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13618
Printed Date: 07 Aug 25 at 7:11pm
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Topic: Future of RRS 17

Posted By: JimC
Subject: Future of RRS 17
Date Posted: 01 Jul 20 at 3:52am

A thread elsewhere got me thinking about RRS17. In the very long term is it possible that rule 17 could disappear as an unnecessary complication?
The point about RRS17 is that the leeward boat acquires ROW.
When the overlap starts the leeward boat is the further back of the two and she cannot change course to windward without windward's stern swinging into her, so windward is protected by RRS 15/16. Once leeward is the further ahead and windward can respond to a change of course by leeward, subject still to 16.1, is it intrinsically wrong that the ROW boat is restricted?
The counter arguments in favour of 17 include, I suppose, that it is a traditional part of the game, and also that it creates a new protest situation with debate over whether the 16.1 protection applied...

Replies:

Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 01 Jul 20 at 7:08am

I think we lose some interesting tactics if we scrap rule 17. But I'm sure more would develop. It means the attacking boat would hold more cards. No idea if that is good or bad. Depends on where you are, I guess!

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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686

Posted By: Brass
Date Posted: 01 Jul 20 at 10:14am

Rule 17 in its entirety is deleted for match racing.

Here is the reasoning

https://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/23215RacingRulesofSailingNewRuleC2.6-%5b19350%5d.pdf" rel="nofollow - https://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/23215RacingRulesofSailingNewRuleC2.6-[19350].pdf

Might work for MR, with one-design boats and competitors who know the rules, particularly the rule 11/rule 16 interactions,

I note that Mark Rushal's RYA Tactics book doesn't mention rule 17 anywhere: the assumption is that competitive (one-design) boats will pro-actively position themselves so that rule 17 never comes into effect.

OK, but for non-top-notch-competitors, in mixed fleets, I'm not convinced it is unnecessary. Lord knows, it's not that difficult.

While there are people around still talking about 'luffing rights' and 'overtaking boats', I don't think deleting rule 17 is all that good an idea.

Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 01 Jul 20 at 10:28am

Originally posted by Brass

While there are people around still talking about 'luffing rights' and 'overtaking boats', I don't think deleting rule 17 is all that good an idea.

That was what got me thinking. If a substantial percentage of sailors get confused about proper course and RRS 17, maybe there's some mileage in eliminating it from section 2.

Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 01 Jul 20 at 10:45am

It certainly seems like a hang over from overtaking boat keeps clear. But it also hits a certain aspect of fair play, which isn't needed in match racing in the same way.

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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686

Posted By: Brass
Date Posted: 01 Jul 20 at 2:37pm

Originally posted by Rupert

It certainly seems like a hang over from overtaking boat keeps clear.

Rather it was a hangover from Leeward may luff as she pleases except ...

Originally posted by Rupert

But it also hits a certain aspect of fair play, which isn't needed in match racing in the same way.

Yes, I think that's right, specially when it used to be complemented by rule 17.2, so you had:

leeward boat can't sail too high;
windward boat can't sail too low.