Banter: Laser Nationals

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Laser Nationals

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Banter
Forum Discription: For all those non-sailing related discussions
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12810
Printed Date: 04 Aug 25 at 6:25pm
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Topic: Laser Nationals

Posted By: craiggo
Subject: Laser Nationals
Date Posted: 31 Jul 17 at 9:51pm

Wow, only 20 boats at the Laser (full rig) nationals. That's got to be the lowest ever surely. We had more than that at our local open meeting!

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OK 2129
RS200 411

Replies:

Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 31 Jul 17 at 10:22pm

Its interesting isn't. The true National have 20 full rig and 70 odd radials plus 50 4.7s, the masters Nationals about 50 of each Full and Radial. Looking at the entry list the true Nationals appears in practice to be a youth event.

I'd be interested to hear whether the Laser CA regards this as a problem.

Posted By: Gordon 1430
Date Posted: 01 Aug 17 at 9:34am

Youth event apart from Matt Howard. If it keeps blowing the rest have a big problem catching him.

He was Giles coach in Rio and is a real downwind animal in a blow.

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Gordon
Phantom 1430

Posted By: Daniel Holman
Date Posted: 01 Aug 17 at 10:37am

Matt is a very good sailor and has also dominated solo nationals in recent years.
Yes sadly it has been downhill the last 10 years for non youth pathway aspects of laser class.
Symptomatic of the chronic underinvestment in the "game" by the builder, who are just milking the cash cow of lots of kids and their parents who still think they are going to be the next ainslie.
15 y ago it used to be a good laugh everyone would party a lot from the Olympic wannabes (for whom the nationals was a "fun" regatta and that was good.
Culturally I think te fun element has been squashed in youth / squad sailing which may mean less liabilities but does not make for a rounded fun event that anyone looks forward to.
Apart from the u18s anyone over 35 or so will just go to master nationals instead where they won't get cuffed by sixth formers and there may be some social activity.

Posted By: piglet
Date Posted: 01 Aug 17 at 10:33pm

In hindsight was the Masters idea good for the class?
My lad is 17, done with squads, still enjoys fleet racing but can't be doing with the pasta and pressure brigade.
He would enjoy the masters scene, but has another 18 years to wait!

Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 02 Aug 17 at 7:54am

The regional circuit open I joined in with at Whitefriars appeared to be made up of club sailors and not too serious, by Laser standards. Some needed to read the rule book a little more closely, though.

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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686

Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 02 Aug 17 at 9:05am

Originally posted by piglet

In hindsight was the Masters idea good for the class?
My lad is 17, done with squads, still enjoys fleet racing but can't be doing with the pasta and pressure brigade.
He would enjoy the masters scene, but has another 18 years to wait!

an interesting point - what this identifies is the chronic underinvestment made by company in the game they should support.

I don't think it would be the correct thing to do to open up the masters to 18 plus or 21 plus... that is, imho, self defeating.

FWIW - if he's off to university, then there's the BUSA fleet racing champs once per year - which are always good fun and historically, the Laser fleet was well contested with a healthy appreciation of the evening activities.

After that, well that's trickier - I guess club & circuit sailing or a change in class are the only options.

I am sure I'm not the only one who read Steve Cockerill's interview about the Aero world champs and thought there's definitely a very healthy future for that class coming to fruition.

Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 02 Aug 17 at 9:12am

I wonder if they should consider running the full rig Laser Nationals with the masters event rather than with what is now the junior event - or at least not at the same time as the radials and 4.7s. Without the hordes of teens and their helicopter parents the adults might feel more inclined to turn out. Rather hard luck on the adult radial sailors though and every championship needs to encourage the ladies if it wants the best possible turnout.

While I hold no candle - to say the least - for Pushchairs inc, I'm not sure what I would have them do about the problem, if such its considered. You'd think the 20-35 age group would be a key marketing group for them to focus on! Maybe the CA should consider splitting out the proper Nationals from the Junior event, but that means running three championships a year, which is a hell of an overhead even for a CA with manufacturer support.

Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 02 Aug 17 at 9:39am

The windsurf racing scene used to run a 'youths and masters' national champs and an open to all series and nationals. Back when I was racing them the youths and masters was a well attended event.

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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"

Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 02 Aug 17 at 9:43am

Originally posted by JimC

I wonder if they should consider running the full rig Laser Nationals with the masters event rather than with what is now the junior event - or at least not at the same time as the radials and 4.7s. Without the hordes of teens and their helicopter parents the adults might feel more inclined to turn out. Rather hard luck on the adult radial sailors though and every championship needs to encourage the ladies if it wants the best possible turnout.

While I hold no candle - to say the least - for Pushchairs inc, I'm not sure what I would have them do about the problem, if such its considered. You'd think the 20-35 age group would be a key marketing group for them to focus on! Maybe the CA should consider splitting out the proper Nationals from the Junior event, but that means running three championships a year, which is a hell of an overhead even for a CA with manufacturer support.

I have to hold a hand up for ignorance on this, but surely there is no actual requirement for a Laser CA youth event on top of the youth nationals run by the RYA? Wasn't it in Hayling this year, Easter time-ish?

From an outside perspective, it does rather look like the Laser CA is focusing on their youth sailing market - but hey, I'm not qualified to say if this is 'problem' per say.

Posted By: Daniel Holman
Date Posted: 02 Aug 17 at 6:59pm

Youth stuff is all rya run, senior and for that mattter master is run by Ca.
End of the day laser is owned and run by a vc who is only really worried about maximum return for minimum outlay in quickest time. Youth and to a lesser extent Olympic stuff is the gravy train, the golden goose which means you don't have to actively market. There has been no new product development by laser performance in the last decade or so (and I don't count taking nearly all that time to get a composite topmasst and radially cut Dacron sail to market )
Guess the proliferation means that informal regional and club racing is ok but I would bet my house that it is no thanks to builder supports.
Literally just wringing the brand and products out. And a lot of suppliers I believe.
If the laser came out as a new entrant to the market now at a fraction of the price it would be laughed off the market.
The other bits that are supposed to justify the cost aren't getting supported. But they get away with it because of the legacy hegemony and economies of scale.