Minisprint
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Choosing a boat
Forum Discription: Ask any questions about the sport!
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12266
Printed Date: 05 Aug 25 at 6:07am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Minisprint
Posted By: iGRF
Subject: Minisprint
Date Posted: 09 Jan 16 at 9:55pm
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So today, I picked up a Minisprint, partly driven by a desire to bother the woddbotherers in the CVDRA later this year and partly driven by the search for a windy weapon of mass bandit destruction down the lake.
So I went up to see it, took a trailer 'just in case' and dropped swmbo off at Lakeside with the credit card on the assumption if I spent money she would, hoping this time it wouldn't cost me a new kitchen. For an old boat, it's got some up to date features, like a wash through hull, it also sports retracting centreboard and una rig, but with a luff sleeve ancient design sail, but it looks like fun, so what the heck, another boat.. a man can't have too many... ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Replies:
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 09 Jan 16 at 10:34pm
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One thing about this - all that can be said bad about the Minisail already has been, so grumph trashing the design in a month won't make any difference. Nationals Staunton Harold 25/26 June. ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 09 Jan 16 at 10:57pm
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Wouldn't have driven up there all that way, to buy something I thought was trash...
I shall find out tomorrow though, then if it is trash I shall be nice about it and quietly flog it, but if it isn't then you might see me in it up your way later in the summer. I'll have to work on it a bit though, can't have all this rear sheeting nonesense, I'm all over that, and the foils look a bit primitive, they could do with some work, then there's that mast, I've got a lovely carbon windsurfing mast that might plug in that hole nicely..  ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 09 Jan 16 at 10:59pm
| Be careful about making changes. They were not overbuilt, and even that was a very long time ago. |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 09 Jan 16 at 11:10pm
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My old plastic boat took a Lightning rig quite happily, so there must be a bit of leeway there. The mast isn't great, but is a lot lighter than the Laser scaffold pole. Be good to see how a carbon mast works. ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 09 Jan 16 at 11:23pm
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The rules state mast be ally, and if,
1 piece, whole mast must be buoyant, 2 piece, top section must be buoyant. I would have thought Windsurfer mast would be more flexible than existing? |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 10:49am
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The rules didn't allow anRS 600 sail lashed to God knows what and bunged up, either, but it didn't stop Dean from trying it!
I think the Class Association needs to think of itself as an owners' group and support whatever gets done to boats, but at the same time try to ensure that when the boats race each other, they are all comparable. After all,if you put 4230 and 3446 next to each other, there isn't much similarity - different hull, different sail, seat/no seat,different boom, different sheeting, different controls, centreboard/dagger board, plus more, I'm sure. Even the mast may be different if yours has the bottle neck? Experimenting with a different mast material, especially as weight-wise it will make no difference, really, seems pretty minor!I do agree it may be too bendy, having tried one on a Tonic, but there must be stiff ones out there! ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 12:16pm
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I would like to see another sailor take an interest in bringing a type of Minisail into the 21th century, if it is another Sprint all the better. I will continue developing mine until I have run out of ideas, but it will be within the "spirit of the rules", for Nationals anyway. This does not mean I would not try a carbon rig, or even a stayed mast with a modern sail. I was disappointed to see Dean keep this rig on his boat during the Nationals. I have the straight mast.
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 3:30pm
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Well I had a fun old time, first outing, in fact it's the first outing this winter with a dry suit which I always find a little constricting, but anyway here's my initial thoughts on it. It sits very low in the water which was the first big surprise, and this one has quite the worse foils I've ever sailed ever. It was one of those days when the wind was up and down like a whores draws. When I first took it out it was quite breezy, then as is customary with starting signals the wind just dropped, which was just as well because the centreboard made the most awful vibrating noise, not just the normal whine you get when you know your moving, this was a violent judder which slowed the boat almost to a standstill, the case needs packing and the foil needs shaping it's blunt both ends like circumference of a 10p coin blunt so it's no small wonder if reverberates.
I've never sailed a boat with such a high boom either, nice the clearance, but not so nice later when it howled, and it's off boom sheeted with loads of rope getting caught everywhere on everything down the back, it has all got to go. The seat has been rigged wrong apparently, the Commodore down the lake used to sail one so I have a mine of useful advice, after the event in this case, isn't it always the way? Oh he was 15 when he sailed it and so it seems were lots of other folk I speak to. I couldn't work out the best way to tack it, looking back which was totally foreign to me seemes to work best, but coming out of a tack butt first just seemed so wrong, although it was so pleasant not having to worry about a full batten to transition, for most of the race it was relatively light with the occasional puff, I had a good start and a half decent lead halfway up the first beat, then it lifted from behind meaning I had to ride a knock to get to the first mark and dipping behind half of the late starters so rounded pretty much next to last, we were a couple of Miracles, a couple of Lasers, one a radial, and some getting too handy youngsters in something plastic with a kite, I managed to get back to third playing nip and tuck with a Laser radial and Miracle, there were seven of us, one Miracle got clear and was gone then a laser then three of us switching for third, then the girls in the tub. I did get into a bit of a rhythm, used that seat thing to hike out but couldn't slide it, had to keep kicking the plate as it washed up but then again when it washed back it stopped making that awful noise, it's almost like a gybing centreboard without a securing knock, but I was having fun which was what's most important, right up until the last lap as I hardened up round the bottom mark misplace my butt and sat straight in backwards.. It all fell apart after that then a Squall came through which seriously tested my patience with another Chinese gybe thingy, I'm good at doing those at the wrong time, I was opposite the club when I finally got it all back together and cold and wet, not wishing to add to the rescue boats further worries I came in, trying to remember my snagging list. Two most important, the centreboard and centre sheeting and with those sorted I think it'll be fun. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 5:43pm
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I spent 12 months perfecting Centre board, worth it though, only issue is bungee, it is either to strong or to weak. The entire assembly of Rudder, Tiller etc, is the worst thing I have ever seen, the designer should have been flogged from one end of the High street to the other and back again, the stock is at least an inch below waterline when sailing. I intend to raise centre of transom and lift bracket entirely clear of water, different stock, probably a cast ally type, and my own developement of a tubercules blade with a reduced chord. I found the battened Sail, did not perform very well when set like a Laser sail, the foot needs to be a bit freer, the fist between sail and boom choked sail too much, same with Leech, do not put loads of Kicker on upwind, also do not try to pull Boom into corner when beating, leave it out about a foot. The high boom is one of the best things about this boat, (use the plank when it is working properly to counter high boom). I do not like aft sheeting either, I did not want centre/aft sheeting either, I went with a 4to1 centre main.
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 6:05pm
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Have you any pictures of your sheeting arrangement which side of the plank do you put it? ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 7:42pm
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The seat in pictures is a prototype, it is fixed, their is no slide, it is longer than plank, I think it is same width as a Merlin, so quite a lot of righting for a single sail. The bar mainsheet block's attached to, is no good, it is a foot trap, it will be changed for a bar attached to centre of seat, this will also allow you to hook foot under to hike My original plan was to fix block to a hoop, similar to Bahia, and attach either side of centreboard slot. http://s1149.photobucket.com/user/aquabatdinghy/media/Minisprint%20rebuild/WP_20150627_16_33_45_Pro.jpg.html?sort=4&o=75" rel="nofollow - WP_20150627_16_33_45_Pro.jpg Photo by aquabatdinghy - Photobucket http://s1149.photobucket.com/user/aquabatdinghy/media/Minisprint%20rebuild/WP_20150624_19_15_04_Pro.jpg.html?sort=4&o=72" rel="nofollow - WP_20150624_19_15_04_Pro.jpg photo by aquabatdinghy
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Posted By: chrisg
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 8:40pm
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Interesting looking boat. Is the mainsheet attached to the same place on the boom as the kicker? Is this attachment on the underside of the boom? The mainsheet looks quite far forward. Does it provide enough leverage being that far forward?
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 9:22pm
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Oh, I'm loving this, finally I can get to tinker about without too much 'class' grief, you've done exactly what I thought it needed just as I fell out of the bloody thing, with that seat, and the centre sheeting. So does the mainsheet block thing slide with the seat or don't you slide it, I'd like some arrangement where you can kick the whole lot out and it self centres when you need to shift back in quickly, considered doing it to the EPS but that sail is so big, there is no where far enough out I could get to compensate for that sail size in the sort of breeze we got today.
Loving what you've done there 423... Inspiring I'm on it, just wish my garage wasn't full of junk so I could start now. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: chrisg
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 10:05pm
| Urr he said his seat was fixed. |
Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 10:47pm
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This seat "could slide", approx' 200mm either side of centre, you could do a slight modification to your design which would allow same movement that you are getting with plank. The seat on mine is tortured to increase curve of original plank, (which is underneath). The Mainsheet block and Kicker is fixed to same bracket, under boom. I have no difficulty pulling boom with 4to1 sheeting. The attachment is further forward than is normal, but I could not find another way to keep it out of the way. The latest mod I am doing is to angle clamcleats, they are a pain to use at the moment, slightest fumble adjustments gone.
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Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 10 Jan 16 at 11:19pm
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I always think an interesting modification if one only wanted a small increase in righting moment would be the little folding winglets they use on some continental Canoe classes like the German Taifun. They're often hinged or pivoted and fold into the boat, and don't create too much disturbance when heeled.
The nice thing about a pukka sliding seat, of course, is that there's nothing on the leeward side. 
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 11 Jan 16 at 10:37am
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I can see me ending up with one of those IC things I've always been fascinated by them, but always get put off by the anoraks at the dinghy show, they're so weird you get the feeling you'll get sucked in, they'll whisk you off to some alien planet and conduct experiments on you, that is if their autism ever lets them engage with the unwashed.
So for now I shall have to make do with what has been christened an 'IC for hobbits' by one of the Miracle wags, whose arse I am going to beat in it if I die in the attempt. Good idea those swivel seat things, has anyone ever managed to make a working self centering thing you kick out with you and it returns if you bend your knees? ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: cad99uk
Date Posted: 11 Jan 16 at 2:02pm
| Go over to SA and see what Dave Clark has done with 'Machete'. |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 11 Jan 16 at 2:27pm
Made a movie starring a really ugly guy? 
Sorry, I'll get my coat and go have a look. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 12 Jan 16 at 6:00pm
| Do you have a link for Dave Clark and Machete, I have searched but could not locate anything. |
Posted By: cad99uk
Date Posted: 12 Jan 16 at 6:06pm
| PM sent |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 12 Jan 16 at 6:10pm
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Me too! All I could find were videos, not close ups or still detail pics.
------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 12 Jan 16 at 6:13pm
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Have a hunt from here.
http://fulcrumspeedworks.com/" rel="nofollow - http://fulcrumspeedworks.com/ |