Repair & maintenance: Halyard

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Halyard

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Repair & maintenance
Forum Discription: Questions & tips on the subject
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11982
Printed Date: 13 Aug 25 at 2:41pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com

Topic: Halyard

Posted By: piglet
Subject: Halyard
Date Posted: 26 Apr 15 at 8:31pm

Sheath went on the 200 main halyard today, managed to knot the Dyneema core so it would hold in the cleat and made it to the start.
Would something like 4mm Vectran be sufficiently low stretch, grip in the cleat and be resistant to wear at the cleat and sheave?

Replies:

Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 27 Apr 15 at 7:31pm

Vectran while very low stretch and in many ways the perfect fibre, is actually not that great long term in the marine environment. Salt and UV cause it to deteriorate. That said with an insert at the cleat point it would do exactly what you want.

So would a 12 strand dyneema product though, and that would be much more stable in the long term. You will want to put an insert at the cleat point to ensure that the cleat grips. I'd make it significantly longer than the cleat length as all 12 strand rope seems to shrink over time as the fibres separate.

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Posted By: piglet
Date Posted: 27 Apr 15 at 10:02pm

Right, you'll have to explain inserts to me, please.
As a temp I have stripped off the remaining sheath and put a couple of well aimed thumb knots in the Dyneema core so it will stick in the cleat.

Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 27 Apr 15 at 10:29pm

If you use a 12 strand braid, using a fid, put a short piece of rope inside the braid to pad it out. Make sure you allow a bit either side of the cleat point.

Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 28 Apr 15 at 7:55am

^Thats right :)^

i'd go a good 6 inches after the cleat point to account for shrinkage. It's amazing how much some of the 12 strand stuff does shrink, especially the cheap stuff - I had some pole downhauls that "lost" 20cm out of a 2.5m length!!

Stick with English Braids or Marlow and you won't go far wrong. Both of these use good quality raw material and both are now using SK78 across the range in their Dyneema products.

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Posted By: Neptune
Date Posted: 28 Apr 15 at 9:15am

It seems to me all the super low stretch cores are now covered in an out sheath (?) of what is effectively cost cutting crap. Its great having this super low stretch stuff but it the outers just shred in cleats, i don't know of any other rope i use in my boat that has such a low durability.

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Musto Skiff and Solo sailor

Posted By: piglet
Date Posted: 28 Apr 15 at 4:58pm

OK, I get inserts now thanks for that, seems simple enough.

Given the slippery nature of Dyneema will it hold in a Clamcleat (Reg.TM) even with an insert?

I know Vectran is much more grippy but not as wear resistant as Dyneema.

Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 29 Apr 15 at 10:57pm

Yes it will. The other trick is to use the sheathed stuff (Excel racing or Dinghy Dyneema) Taper it down, eye splice and use a hook rack as you would with wire.

I'd want a new clam cleat with a 12 strand dyneema halyard, a worn one would be shown up quite quickly i think.

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Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 29 Apr 15 at 11:02pm

Originally posted by Neptune

It seems to me all the super low stretch cores are now covered in an out sheath (?) of what is effectively cost cutting crap. Its great having this super low stretch stuff but it the outers just shred in cleats, i don't know of any other rope i use in my boat that has such a low durability.

The outer jacket is more to enable you or a cleat to grip the rope to adjust or hold it. Add to that that the cores have come on tremendously in the last 5 years in terms of stretch resistance while the outer jacket is still often polyester which does stretch and it;s little surprise that they get shredded. The jacket wants to move but can't because the core stays put.

I think we dinghy sailors often over engineer stuff and use inappropriate materials for the job. Polyester control lines are fine on most things, but because they are relatively cheap most enthusiasts don't use them.

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Posted By: piglet
Date Posted: 30 Apr 15 at 12:57pm

Originally posted by Paramedic

Yes it will. The other trick is to use the sheathed stuff (Excel racing or Dinghy Dyneema) Taper it down, eye splice and use a hook rack as you would with wire.

I'd want a new clam cleat with a 12 strand dyneema halyard, a worn one would be shown up quite quickly i think.

I would be happy with wire & rack but I suspect RS class rules have all that sewn up.

I might try inserting the old core, if it slips on the day I will have to knot it again.

Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 30 Apr 15 at 5:15pm

Just insert an offcut of the new rope. Simple :)

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Posted By: piglet
Date Posted: 04 May 15 at 10:11pm

Yup, old core with a 3/4 metre of 4mm control pulled in seemed to hold though not breezy today, I'm sure it will be fine.
Thanks chaps, a repair for £00.00p