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Protesting on the water

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Contender 541 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender 541 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Protesting on the water
    Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 5:53pm

Boats are coming to the mark

One of the boats hit the mark

Others see this and call for helm to do his / her turns

Conversdations in the clubhouse afterwards because the word 'Protest' was not used

Discuss

When you find a big kettle of crazy it's probably best not to stir it - Pointy Haired Boss

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Stefan Lloyd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 5:56pm

You would indeed need to hail "protest".

 

61 PROTEST REQUIREMENTS

61.1 Informing the Protestee

(a) A boat intending to protest shall inform the other boat at the

first reasonable opportunity. When her protest concerns an incident

in the racing area that she is involved in or sees, she shall

hail ‘Protest’ and conspicuously display a red flag at the first reasonable

opportunity for each. She shall display the flag until she

is no longer racing. However,

(1) if the other boat is beyond hailing distance, the protesting

boat need not hail but she shall inform the other boat at

the first reasonable opportunity;

(2) if the hull length of the protesting boat is less than 6

metres, she need not display a red flag;

(3) if the incident results in damage or injury that is obvious

to the boats involved and one of them intends to protest,

the requirements of this rule do not apply to her, but she

shall attempt to inform the other boat within the time

limit of rule 61.3.

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Contender 541 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender 541 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 10:06pm

Bugger

Don't you hate it when someone else confirms that a 15 year old is right and you are wrong 

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Black no sugar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 06 at 9:40am

Take avoiding action: make sure the 15-year old doesn't join the forum! 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote tack'ho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 06 at 9:51am

Did the boat do their turns?

If not and they knew they had hit the mark and were attempting to escape the punishment on a technicality there may well be a infringement to the sporstmanlike condut rule (19?). Where's our tame judge? 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Ian S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 06 at 10:39am

I think you could argue this a number of ways, there is no requirement to actually protest a boat that has infringed the rules as a good sailor will acknowledge the fault and take their penalty, in this case bear in mind the requirement to get clear and then take the penalty.

Hence the "first reasonable opportunity" does not mean that you have to yell protest as your first words, it is acceptable to ask a boat if they will be taking the penalty when they are first able to do so, if they refuse then this becomes your first reasonable opportunity to hail protest. But you must use the word protest.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Scooby_simon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 06 at 11:19am
Originally posted by Ian S

I think you could argue this a number of ways, there is no requirement to actually protest a boat that has infringed the rules as a good sailor will acknowledge the fault and take their penalty, in this case bear in mind the requirement to get clear and then take the penalty.

Hence the "first reasonable opportunity" does not mean that you have to yell protest as your first words, it is acceptable to ask a boat if they will be taking the penalty when they are first able to do so, if they refuse then this becomes your first reasonable opportunity to hail protest. But you must use the word protest.

 

I would argue stronly against this just for clarity.

Hail protest and then withdraw it if they do their turn(s).  Shows you are serious.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote tack'ho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 06 at 11:33am
depends on the venue, nats yes, club race depends.  If its an experienced sailor who you'r fighting for overall series postion with and will understand what your up to yes, against a newcomer to the club/sport who may just need a little guidance and could quite easily be put off by a club oldie screaming protest at them, I think not. 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sargesail Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 06 at 12:41pm

No 2 ways.  Say protest first and take it from there.

Anything else you open it up for doubt and obfuscation.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote tack'ho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Mar 06 at 1:16pm
As a sailor who has had to go over to a newbie after a race who didn't understand part of a rule was shouted at by a more experienced sailor who had made a poor start a was therefore mixing it up with backmarkers, I feel that it can be a little counter productive to shout protest at someone who doesn't know any better at the moment.  Frankly if your being affected by the type of sailor who is still unsure about things you need to sort out your own sailing first, a friendly call of you should really do two turns there will often have a more beneficial affect than shouting protest.  Different rules apply at the front of the fleet or at opens or Nats, as I said but I think you've really got to be taking yourself very seriously to wade in at the back.  Mind you the old saying about moe shouting at the back is probably quite right. In fact we are instigating a start of season rules clinic to which only the less experienced are allowed to attend!  I'm looking foward to seeing some older bolder sailors being corrected by a beginner this season
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