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More Corrupt BS

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Olympic Sailing
Forum Discription: The top end racing in our sport
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12934
Printed Date: 22 Jan 18 at 10:04pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: More Corrupt BS
Posted By: iGRF
Subject: More Corrupt BS
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 10:47am
https://www.sailingillustrated.com/single-post/2017/12/11/Olympics-World-Sailings-radical-plan-to-overhaul-2024-eventsclasses" rel="nofollow - Windsurfing Out, Kite Monopoly, Mixed Classes


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Replies:
Posted By: davidyacht
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 11:10am
Just sums up how out of touch World Sailing is with the sport.  Really can't how the proposed keelboat class with overnight sailing is going to fit into an Olympic template.  Have just filled in a survey for Workd Sailing completely about social media and sponsorship ... nothing about developing the sport at grass roots.

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Somewhere between lies and truth lies the truth


Posted By: ifoxwell
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 11:39am
It is for the event to be held in France however, the home of short handed off shore sailing... cant be a coincidence can it

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Blaze 715


Posted By: sargesail
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 3:39pm
Short-handed: French flavour and one that has real interest world-wide.  Not only that it will be the longest duration single event of the Olympics and that will make it both accessible to a world-wide audience, and add interest.

As for kiting over-windsurfing: I admire the extreme athleticism of the windsurfers and their CV fitness levels, but I don't recognise the light to medium wind pump fest as sailing.  Kiting seems much cleaner in that respect.


Posted By: sargesail
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 3:40pm
Also mixed is good for the sports profile.  One of the only genuinely mixed events in sport.


Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 4:16pm
Originally posted by sargesail

Short-handed: French flavour and one that has real interest world-wide.  Not only that it will be the longest duration single event of the Olympics and that will make it both accessible to a world-wide audience, and add interest.

As for kiting over-windsurfing: I admire the extreme athleticism of the windsurfers and their CV fitness levels, but I don't recognise the light to medium wind pump fest as sailing.  Kiting seems much cleaner in that respect.

+1


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Posted By: Presuming Ed
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 4:36pm
Originally posted by sargesail

Short-handed: French flavour and one that has real interest world-wide.  Not only that it will be the longest duration single event of the Olympics and that will make it both accessible to a world-wide audience, and add interest.

As for kiting over-windsurfing: I admire the extreme athleticism of the windsurfers and their CV fitness levels, but I don't recognise the light to medium wind pump fest as sailing.  Kiting seems much cleaner in that respect.

+1 x2. 
So nice of you to write what Iím thinking. Saves me so much time. Thanks!!


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 9:05pm
We'll see.

ISAF/WS has issued a press release which sort of rubbishes that press report ( http://www.sailing.org/news/85767.php" rel="nofollow - http://www.sailing.org/news/85767.php ), but unfortunately their ability to write a report of the conference seems to have deserted them in favour of posting mind boggling tedious and unwatchable videos of the meetings so its hard to work out WTF is going on.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 10:08pm
So it seems likely they'll announce exactly what "Sailing Illustrated" have just leaked? Embarrassed

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Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 13 Dec 17 at 11:04pm
It may be more complicated than that... The traditional way of doing Olympic class selection is a massive horse trading exercise at the annual conference, in which all sorts of proposals come and go, and the end result isn't necessarily what the executive wanted. You may remember that kites were in and then out again within a few hours at the last selection session as different groups had their say. The council gets the final say.

What that document is alleging is that the staff side is going to attempt to railroad the decision through with an email vote in the spring, instead of it going through the normal long winded and acrimonious (and democratic) process in November.

The choice of classes is one thing, but if the executive are really seeking to railroad something through like that (and there are to me some hints in the ISAF pr that there may be an element of that) then that is to me a really big deal and something that ought to be stamped on.

Its interesting too, because the RYA, apparently as a result of legislation changes, also seems to be changing their management structure so the full time execs and managers will have much more power, and the representatives in the council much less.


Posted By: mozzy
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 9:01am
Originally posted by Presuming Ed

[QUOTE=sargesail]Short-handed: French flavour and one that has real interest world-wide.  Not only that it will be the longest duration single event of the Olympics and that will make it both accessible to a world-wide audience, and add interest.

As for kiting over-windsurfing: I admire the extreme athleticism of the windsurfers and their CV fitness levels, but I don't recognise the light to medium wind pump fest as sailing.  Kiting seems much cleaner in that respect.
+3
I think it's a good idea. 

If anything the regatta format we have currently doesn't fit well in to the 'Olympic template' which has led to medal races and random lay days.  Having TV presenters checking in on the offshore progress between other events would mesh well and there's no postponements to worry about. 

The big issue though is equipment and a world series leading up the Olympics. I get the impression there is a big drive for equipment to be internationally available which if that's a push for the present events, it will be even harder for an offshore class to claim. 

There is a well established World Sailing World Series and continental events which is used for sailor rankings and selection, alongside world championships. It pretty easy to substitute another dinghy or small keel boat, or even match or team racing in to these events... but not so much shorthanded offshore sailing. None of this exists for offshore racing. 


Posted By: sargesail
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 9:12am
Production Mini Class?


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 10:12am
Originally posted by sargesail

As for kiting over-windsurfing: I admire the extreme athleticism of the windsurfers and their CV fitness levels, but I don't recognise the light to medium wind pump fest as sailing. †Kiting seems much cleaner in that respect.
Which is all well and good if the participants really wanted inclusion (Kiting can be equally atheletic the propulsion style is just different) but the few course racing style competitors that exist in the kite world are ambivalent at best and at worse do not want to be railroaded by the Pryde Organisation into an agricultural One Design purely for the financial benefit of that organisation. The sport is still evolving quite rapidly so if they were to be involved they'd prefer a box design and open equipment supply, they also don't want the rider weight restrictions that One Design will bring. But it matters not what anyone thinks the decision appears already to have been taken at a business meeting a few months back, the Pryde Organisation has all the means to 'accommodate MNA reps' and they are also hedging their bets with an OD foiling windsurfer just in case.

Most kitsurfers don't believe they are 'sailors', kite flyers, kiteboard 'riders', kite pilots even, they certainly do not want the prescriptions of World Sailing and I can't say I blame them.

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Posted By: mozzy
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 11:06am
Originally posted by iGRF

the few course racing style competitors that exist in the kite world are ambivalent at best and at worse do not want to be railroaded by the Pryde Organisation into an agricultural One Design purely for the financial benefit of that organisation. 

Most kitsurfers don't believe they are 'sailors', kite flyers, kiteboard 'riders', kite pilots even, they certainly do not want the prescriptions of World Sailing and I can't say I blame them.

Whether being in the Olympics is good for a sport or not is another debate. 

Going that way leads you in to a path of prescriptive equipment selection and well defined 'rules'. This is good for building pathways and adding structure to a developed sport.

But I get the impression that for new sports you need the slightly anarchistic competition formats and equipment mix to truly work out what the sport is about before you start closing it down with rules.  


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 11:27am
Being in the Olympics is only good for those involved in 'managing' a sport, the Gravy train, it's never imv been about us as competitors, these days it's purely about revenue and emerging 'action' sports are perceived as good TV, they're wrong, action sports followers are more about taking part than watching, but then it's not about them either is it?

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Posted By: Do Different
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 12:44pm
On that we agree iGRF and that is from a senior railcard holding dinghy sailor. Watching holds only fleeting interest for me.


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 12:56pm
Steady now.. agreeing with me will get you struck off Santa's list..

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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 1:32pm
I'd say you were on pretty safe ground in suggesting that vested interest might have influenced WS/ISAF/IYRU decisions over the years. Are Neil Pryde still making 49er sails?

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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 1:50pm
No Idea, up until recently (this summer) Neil Pryde didn't market kites under their own brand name, using Cabrinha for presumably better image. I should have realised what was going on when a guy came on the phone asking for advice on kite distribution, I just thought he'd just embarked on Mission Impossible. It's taken me three years to introduce a new kite brand to this country and it's a well established European outfit who make really excellent kites. It's a very tight and over subscribed market so not something to enter lightly and certainly not as a micro niche like racing foils unless you know something no-one else does in regards to the future activities of World Sailing.


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Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 14 Dec 17 at 9:31pm
If they are going to put Kite surfing in the Olympics they may as well have Jetski's too, both are anti social in use and controlled ? by yobs.


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 15 Dec 17 at 3:39pm
I think you'll find it's the RYA that control them both so yes, you could be right.

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Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 15 Dec 17 at 5:35pm


Posted By: 423zero
Date Posted: 16 Dec 17 at 5:10pm
Yachtings Own BS



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