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420?

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Technique
Forum Discription: 'How to' section for dinghy questions and answers
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12647
Printed Date: 19 Oct 17 at 11:06pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: 420?
Posted By: James_Gibson
Subject: 420?
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 5:34pm
Just looking for some advice on racing more.
14 years old with some club racing experience in a buzz and a 400.
Ive been interested in the 420, is that the right choice ( want a double hander ), is there any northern youth racing in the 420? if not, what else should i consider, needs to have decent northern youth racing, cheers.



Replies:
Posted By: jaydub
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 6:07pm
RS200.  Very active Northern Youth Squad, although you've missed the boat for this year's winter training.  You will have to sail against some old gits as well though. Wink

Whereabouts do you sail?


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 7:19pm
NW 420 training at Leigh & Lowton a couple of weeks ago. 29ers and Fevas in the last few weeks too. I'd say it depends where you want to take it in say the next 5 years.

http://www.llsc.org.uk" rel="nofollow - http://www.llsc.org.uk


Posted By: cad99uk
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 9:50pm
29er no question. Do not even look at a 420.


Posted By: James_Gibson
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 9:56pm
Have thought of 200, only ruled out 29er because it can be difficult to find at cheaper end... Between the 200 and 29er which would I be pumping more money into?


Posted By: James_Gibson
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 9:58pm
Also, sailing around Yorkshire. At a small scout centre, but also race fairly regularly at grimwith (YDSC) but wanting to travel bit more.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 10:08pm
How far and often would you travel?


Posted By: cad99uk
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 10:13pm
Make sure you sail a 200 and a 29er before you decide. They are chalk and cheese.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 10:27pm
Yup, and a 420 is much closer to a 200 (and a 400 or Buzz) than to a 29er FWIW. If you fancy a bash at international youth sailing the 420 or 29er is the way to go but if it's just a bit more class racing in the North of England then do a bit of googling for suitable open meetings and club results to find out where the fleets are. Sadly there is not very much open meeting action 'north of Watford" these days with most classes being concentrated in the South. If you are happy with handicap racing I'd have to agree that a 200 is probably the best bet (simply going off the turnouts at the L&LSC Icicle series). There are plenty of good guys at YDSC who could advise you, "Hector" (Keith E) of this parish sails a 29er at Yorkshire Dales (but he is actually just selling it I think).


Posted By: James_Gibson
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 10:45pm
Would want to travel mainly around north, but willing to to go further for bigger events. As for how often, I'm not sure yet as it depends on what I get and to where I'll have to travel.


Posted By: James_Gibson
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 10:46pm
Originally posted by cad99uk

Make sure you sail a 200 and a 29er before you decide. They are chalk and cheese.

Cheers, just need to find someone who's willing to give me a go.


Posted By: James_Gibson
Date Posted: 30 Jan 17 at 10:50pm
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons



Yup, and a 420 is much closer to a 200 (and a 400 or Buzz) than to a 29er FWIW. If you fancy a bash at international youth sailing the 420 or 29er is the way to go but if it's just a bit more class racing in the North of England then do a bit of googling for suitable open meetings and club results to find out where the fleets are. Sadly there is not very much open meeting action 'north of Watford" these days with most classes being concentrated in the South. If you are happy with handicap racing I'd have to agree that a 200 is probably the best bet (simply going off the turnouts at the L&LSC Icicle series). There are plenty of good guys at YDSC who could advise you, "Hector" (Keith E) of this parish sails a 29er at Yorkshire Dales (but he is actually just selling it I think).


Yeh that was unfortunately true for the buzz, it was always a long trek for any races against other buzzes. I'll ask around and see if I can get a go in a 200, yeh I believe he's just sold his. Thanks for the info.


Posted By: jaydub
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 12:01am
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

There are plenty of good guys at YDSC who could advise you, "Hector" (Keith E) of this parish sails a 29er at Yorkshire Dales (but he is actually just selling it I think).
Keith E is actually a 200 sailor with a 29er to sell, but that makes him a pretty good guy to ask.  As Sam says his username is Hector on here.  Why not drop him a PM?

The advantage of the 200 over the 29er is the quality of the racing you can get without your parents having to spend weekends camped out at Weymouth, etc.  There is an active Northern Circuit circuit of 8 events with a fairly even spread of youth boats and more experienced sailors.

It really depends on what you want to achieve from your sailing and how much time and money your parents are willing to commit to.




Posted By: James_Gibson
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 7:41am

Keith E is actually a 200 sailor with a 29er to sell, but that makes him a pretty good guy to ask. As Sam says his username is Hector on here. Why not drop him a PM?
The advantage of the 200 over the 29er is the quality of the racing you can get without your parents having to spend weekends camped out at Weymouth, etc. There is an active Northern Circuit circuit of 8 events with a fairly even spread of youth boats and more experienced sailors.
It really depends on what you want to achieve from your sailing and how much time and money your parents are willing to commit to.
[/QUOTE]

Yeh, I'll try and pm him. Well, I'm buying the boat myself so the 200 might be the better option, especially if I don't have to travel as far. Would you know who to talk to about the northern youth squads?


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 7:54am
If you fancy being the next Is Walker, then go the 420 route. If you want to handicap race, then there are probably better options. However, it will teach you all you need to know about boat tune, set up and symmetric Spinnakers.

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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Leader, Topper 44496, yellow Minisail


Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 8:16am
The only thing about the 420 and 29er is they're pretty much squaddie boats and not much else (29er less so i think). They are expensive to get into properly and once you're in your class racing is it training events and selectors only - or at least this is how it appears, when did you last see a 420 open meeting report?

I'm sure the RYA training system is excellent, especially if you show promise and progress through the system, but the cost of travel, the boat and the time you need to put in may well take the fun out of it - sailing is something you should do because you want to not because you have to.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 10:03am
Just had a quick look at Yorkshire Dales sail wave results for the autumn series, there were 6 x 200s and 2 x 29ers (one sailed by Keith's brother Ian) out of 46 boats entered (and no 420s).

Supplimentary question :- do you have a regular and equally committed crew?


Posted By: James_Gibson
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 11:29am
Yes, I have a committed crew. I'm thinking more towards the 200 as it is more in my price range and has more northern presence. Thanks for all the advice


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 12:39pm
The 200 seems a more versatile boat than the 29er too, not so 'skiffy' and a bit less radical so better suited to the smaller lakes many dinghy clubs sail on.

Good luck


Posted By: zippyRN
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 4:12pm
Originally posted by Paramedic

The only thing about the 420 and 29er is they're pretty much squaddie boats and not much else (29er less so i think). They are expensive to get into properly and once you're in your class racing is it training events and selectors only - or at least this is how it appears, when did you last see a 420 open meeting report?

I'm sure the RYA training system is excellent, especially if you show promise and progress through the system, but the cost of travel, the boat and the time you need to put in may well take the fun out of it - sailing is something you should do because you want to not because you have to.

is the four-twinkie's  durability still a bit suspect  due to the french bathroom designer lack of   cross  structural bracing ?


Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 6:11pm
Originally posted by zippyRN


is the four-twinkie's  durability still a bit suspect  due to the french bathroom designer lack of   cross  structural bracing ?

They used to be abysmal in terms of longevity, i think one builder has got them as good as they are ever likely to get but i would imagine you still wouldn't want to be the third or fourth owner after 7 or 8 years hard use. 

Cant comment from first hand experience though, and to be fair this is not unique to 420s though i believe perceived resale value to be a striking weakness of the class.


Posted By: chris_wht
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 6:46pm
Buy whichever boat (which you can afford) most makes you get up in the morning and go "god dammit, i wanna go sailing"

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Posted By: jaydub
Date Posted: 31 Jan 17 at 10:18pm
Originally posted by James_Gibson


Yeh, I'll try and pm him. Well, I'm buying the boat myself so the 200 might be the better option, especially if I don't have to travel as far. Would you know who to talk to about the northern youth squads?
I'll drop you the details in a PM.


Posted By: PeteM
Date Posted: 08 Feb 17 at 9:26am
I'm surprised no one has mentioned a Fireball, there are loads of competitive f'balls at great prices, last time I looked they were well spread out around the country and there is good class racing at many clubs or at the worst several other boats to play with.. Having a trapeze also makes it much more fun. I sold my last woodie f'ball for what I paid for it after 3 years racing and could have upgraded fairly cheaply to a Winder except I wanted a change.  But it is a great boat and for anything from say 500 upwards you'll get a great sail and plenty of others to play with!   Just a thought!


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Osprey Mk 5 1365
Peviously Sailed 4 x Fireball, 1 x RS500, 1 x 505   All nice boats


Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 08 Feb 17 at 11:03am
Forget about the boat itself - both teach good skills, but nothing you can't pick up later on.  

Choose the class with the best (for you) social scene....  be honest about how much time the next 4 years you'll have  to travel (school stuff is about to get bat-sh*t crazy and it doesn't ease off into A-Levels or their equivalent) and speak to your folks if they are prepared to drag you around until you get your own wheels.  

Whatever you do, have as much fun as you can, swap boats with mates and switch around crews if you guys have a group rolling  ... these could very well be the best sailing years of your life until you retire, so make the absolute most of it mate.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 08 Feb 17 at 11:12am
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