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Post Options Post Options   Quote Neptune Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Oct 12 at 4:48pm
Finn is not for lightweights is it, unless you count 95 kg light
RS300, ex Musto Skiff
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Post Options Post Options   Quote alstorer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 12 at 9:19am

Originally posted by gordon

Rupert - Finn and 470 changes to rule 42 only apply to official class racing. When these boats are sailing in a handicap fleet then the rules of the handicap system apply.

that'll be because it isn't a class rule, it's a standard SI change.

The same with the RS boats. Their apparent inability to sail round a mark without hitting it is only allowed in class racing, not in handicap racing.

 

as is this. Not a class rule, an SI change, and one that's often used beyond RS classes

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Al
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Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 12 at 10:27am
alstorer - other way round, at least for the Finns:

Sailing instructions may NOT modify rule 42 (rule 86.1b) but Class rules may (86.1c)

Finn Class rules DO modify rule 42:

C.1.1 RULES
(1) RRS 42.3 is changed by adding a new RRS 42.3 (i):
42.3(i) The Race Committee may signal in accordance with RRS
Appendix P5 that pumping, rocking and ooching are permitted after
the starting signal, except when the boat’s proper course is closehauled
or above. This changes rules 42.2(a), 42.2(b) and 42.2(c).
(2) The Finn Class recommends that race committees apply Rule C.1.1 (1)
in winds of 10 knots and above, measured at deck level on a race
committee boat at the windward mark. See also A.7.2.

For the RS boats - Class rules may not modify rule 31 (rule 86.1c) but sailing instructions may (86.1b). A class may therefore suggest that when a club organises a RS race they modify the SIs. According to the rules it is the Race Committee who publish the SIs.It would be interesting to know if a club or race committee has ever refused!

Do you have examples of SIs  other than RS classes modifying rule 31.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote alstorer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 12 at 5:06pm

I don#t have them to hand, but it is fairly routine for B14 and Musto SIs to remove the penalty for hitting marks- but not always, which keeps us on our toes. Think Cherubs often have it as well, 49ers, 29ers, 4000s, ISOs?

Edit: I14s at Hayling this weekend



Edited by alstorer - 07 Oct 12 at 5:10pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 12 at 5:59pm
Not surprising that I had not heard of this as none of these classes sai in Ireland, nor, indeed in France when I lived there.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 12 at 11:06am
Originally posted by alstorer

I don#t have them to hand, but it is fairly routine for B14 and Musto SIs to remove the penalty for hitting marks- but not always, which keeps us on our toes. Think Cherubs often have it as well, 49ers, 29ers, 4000s, ISOs?

Edit: I14s at Hayling this weekend

 

Taken from above link

Touching a mark (other than a starting or finishing mark) with any part of the boat or crew shall incur no penalty. Manhandling a mark that results in an advantage is not allowed and a boat so doing shall promptly retire.

... so you can touch marks without penalty, but 'manhandling' them is a straight retire-or-DSQ, I wonder how you judge having to un-tangle the bouy mooring rope from your t-foil in this case?

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Post Options Post Options   Quote alstorer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Nov 12 at 11:14am
I think that's covered in "that results in an advantage"- you could say that the manhandling results in an advantage in as much as it allows you to finish rather than be sat on your upturned boat whilst everyone curses you for making the mark harder to get round, but realistically you've gained a massive tiime pentlaty by cutting things so close to the mark, so no requirment to retire and no DSQ. I'd certainly hope that's what would happen if someone was petty enough to protest your misfortune
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