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29er rudder pin seized

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timeonthewater View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote timeonthewater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 29er rudder pin seized
    Posted: 19 Apr 12 at 8:51pm
Unfortunately trying to take off my rudder,( as I noticed some play in it and wished to replace the top gudgeon), it seems that the rudder pin is well seized in the alloy stock.

Despite anti seizing spray, hammers, bearing pullers on the rudder pin..it refuses to budge., it's bloody well welded itself.  Although i'd love to shell our 130 for a new one, plus gudgeons and pin..I'm sure there's a solution out there?

I've just learnt from the Musto skiff website and from Ovington boats, that they supply their universal alloy stock, now with plastic shims, to stop such alloy/stainless seizures. 

Any advice on pin removal.? My next plan is heating up the stock with a plumber's blowtorch and getting very physical with the pin and a hammer.
Too many toys..not enough time
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Apr 12 at 10:17pm
I think I'd avoid the hammer: too much risk of swellling the pin further and blowtorch round glass fibre feels unwise. Warmth, penetrating oil and continuing pressure from a bearing puller would be my approach. Failing that try sawing the pin up to remove the stock from the boat and you can then deal with the rest on the bench.

Edited by JimC - 19 Apr 12 at 10:22pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender 541 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 12 at 7:58am
Stupid as it sounds.......
Coca Cola and time will unsieze  most things - Ideally you would imerse the siezed bit in coke, but just keeping it wet for a few days should do the trick
When you find a big kettle of crazy it's probably best not to stir it - Pointy Haired Boss

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Post Options Post Options   Quote alstorer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 12 at 8:35am
I take it you can't get a screwdriver in to just remove the whole thing?
 
Also, bit late for this, but I'd suggest in future always taking it off...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote timeonthewater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 12 at 10:18pm
I've taken the whole assembly off the boat, so have the stock, pin and gudgeons in one unit.

The vice on the pin and moving the stock has had no affect.  Re the coke method, full fat coke or coke max?
Methinks a new rudder stock would be the answer if all else fails!.  

Jim, is the stock glass fibre ?

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Post Options Post Options   Quote timeonthewater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Apr 12 at 10:32pm
Jim
I'm tempted go all out and go carbon dagger blade and cassette rather than go for the same kit from Ovi's. 
Simon McGuire's carbon stock looks very good, any others you may recommend?

It's for a project boat, not a 29er I might add!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender 541 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 12 at 5:18pm
Originally posted by timeonthewater

I've taken the whole assembly off the boat, so have the stock, pin and gudgeons in one unit.

The vice on the pin and moving the stock has had no affect.  Re the coke method, full fat coke or coke max?
Methinks a new rudder stock would be the answer if all else fails!.  

Jim, is the stock glass fibre ?

 
Full Fat is the best
When you find a big kettle of crazy it's probably best not to stir it - Pointy Haired Boss

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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 12 at 5:56pm
I honestly don't know what the 29er stock is made of but have half a memory its alloy...

The critical component in the CocaCola is the phosphoric acid - the same stuff you get in so called rust eating compounds, so it probably doesn't make much difference whether you use diet or not. I don't know how much effect it will have in this case, but unlikely to do any harm.

Stocks - I'bve always made my own so have no idea whose are good. The article on the Cherub web site started out as how I did my last one...

Edited by JimC - 21 Apr 12 at 5:59pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender 541 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Apr 12 at 9:33pm
Originally posted by JimC

I honestly don't know what the 29er stock is made of but have half a memory its alloy...

The critical component in the CocaCola is the phosphoric acid - the same stuff you get in so called rust eating compounds, so it probably doesn't make much difference whether you use diet or not. I don't know how much effect it will have in this case, but unlikely to do any harm.

Stocks - I'bve always made my own so have no idea whose are good. The article on the Cherub web site started out as how I did my last one...
 
 
Indeed Jim - the Phosphoric acid is the major component (It really does not matter which to use)
 
I once saw a Radial drill that had been in a field for 20 years bought back to life with nothing more than a can of coke and time (It was an original machine tool of a victorian pumping station and the owners tracked it down.  Once it had been bought back to the pumping station, the drill was bolted to the floor and tension chains attached to the radial arm.  A can of coke was poured down the pillar. 3 months it took, but eventually the chains went slack - only took another 2 years to get working after that!!)
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Post Options Post Options   Quote timeonthewater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 12 at 7:12am
Well after a week and a bit of exposure to it's diet of Coca Cola, I can report sadly that the experiment failed miserably. Although the large aluminium saucepan and alloy stock look a little brighter.

The stainless pin is well seized and galled in, even trying to remove it with another stainless pin and mark 1 club hammer did nothing but to destroy the stock.

Unfortunately the way the boat is designed, you can't remove the rudder or pin, as it is held captive by the flange beneath the lower gudgeon.  So a new rudder assembly required.
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