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iGRF View Drop Down
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Posts: 6496 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Not seen at the show
    Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 11:37am
Good to see they're sensible with kids and helmets even if the rest of the world is more concerned with buoyancy vests than something that is more likely to do you permanent damage and clearly has, I wonder just how much boom induced head injury plays a part in PYAG decision making.
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Cirrus View Drop Down
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Posts: 590 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 11:43am

I would have tried to juggle the jib and chute mouth to put the chute ahead of the jib tack but too late for that now...

Old Timer / Mike ... See previous/earlier discussion on the reasons - on balance it is much better to have an easy (much larger) opening behind the jib than a smaller one in front.  We also wanted the pole to exit upwards at an angle - this means it exits the hull just where you might otherwise have wanted to put the chute opening.  (I rather like to see where we are going !!)




Edited by Cirrus - 08 Mar 18 at 11:46am
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Old Timer View Drop Down
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Posts: 370 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Old Timer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 11:57am
I would have moved the jib tack to behind on that stainless bar ... raised the foredeck a bit to increase the mouth area .... but you have made you choice and I am sure you are happy with that ...

I doubt there will be any fleet racing so easy of use would have been my priority.
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6649 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 12:49pm
You might wish to consider why the kite equipped Int Canoes universally have the kite chute behind the jib even though their jibs are well set back from the bow. There are are always pros and cons to every arrangement, but for whatever my experience is worth I would not consider having a chute in front of the forestay on that boat.

Edited by JimC - 08 Mar 18 at 2:09pm
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Posts: 590 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 2:03pm

Old Timer ....

Each to their own ... but the specification called for a LARGE opening in any event.  Several of those influencing the design have 'fought' with keyhole ones in previous classes.  Compromised chute aperture sizing frankly really is the worst of all worlds wherever the chute goes.. in our opinion at least.  I'm sure the spinnaker equipped canoes need ease of operation even more than we do in a crew boat and like  this boat their bows do not permit a large opening right on the bow wherever you put the forestay !  This boat is all about efficiency and therefore only needs moderate sized sails.. one of our key objectives btw.  Sure we could have made the hull half a metre longer - but but then more weight etc etc and then larger sails required and that includes the spinnaker. 

If you look back a couple of pages there is a pic of a Viper sportsboat - all 23' of it plus bowsprit.  It has a large spinnaker and consequently a large chute ... and it is still sat behind the forestay.   Size might not be everything - but so is position ...  Wink

Oh ... we did forget to say earleir the boat is known as ‘Venom’... (work it out ...)



Edited by Cirrus - 08 Mar 18 at 2:04pm
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iGRF View Drop Down
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Posts: 6496 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 2:30pm
Such bollox trying to justify dragging your kite around the forestay time and again when a simple system stops all that.
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fab100 View Drop Down
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Posts: 1005 		Post Options Post Options   Quote fab100 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 2:49pm
Originally posted by Cirrus

I would have tried to juggle the jib and chute mouth to put the chute ahead of the jib tack but too late for that now...

Old Timer / Mike ... See previous/earlier discussion on the reasons - on balance it is much better to have an easy (much larger) opening behind the jib than a smaller one in front.  We also wanted the pole to exit upwards at an angle - this means it exits the hull just where you might otherwise have wanted to put the chute opening.  (I rather like to see where we are going !!)



I am not sure that spinny is going to set so well on port with neither sheet in front of the forestay


Edited by fab100 - 08 Mar 18 at 2:50pm
Great book for Club Sailors here
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Cirrus View Drop Down
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Posts: 590 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 5:30pm
I am not sure that spinny is going to set so well on port with neither sheet in front of the forestay...

Of course 100 ... But with no spinnaker in the sock it will not set either side really !!   ... and all lines are simply tied off anywhere to hand.  Big smile

GRFi ... It is not like Venom was developed for you really.   Those who have forsaken the spinnaker thing (for reasons still unknown ?)  don't really get a say here ....  Stick to hanging around a while on that spare rigging dangling off the mast on your new ride (nothing there that 2' on hull length would not solve btw - just saying) ... LOL


Edited by Cirrus - 08 Mar 18 at 5:32pm
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Riv View Drop Down
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Posts: 353 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Riv Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 5:41pm
I've never liked dragging expensive, carefully crafted spinnakers through holes in any deck in any position and nor do I like bags.

Just came across a video of a Weta beating an FD around a course so it must be quite fast and it has a Screecher which stays up all the time and does seem to work well. So apart from drag and weight in the wrong place (doesn't seem to hurt the Weta) why don't asymetric boats use a furler instead of a chute? Is the performance loss so massive or is it now traditional?
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Posts: 3011 		Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Mar 18 at 5:58pm
Originally posted by JimC

You might wish to consider why the kite equipped Int Canoes universally have the kite chute behind the jib even though their jibs are well set back from the bow. There are are always pros and cons to every arrangement, but for whatever my experience is worth I would not consider having a chute in front of the forestay on that boat.

I don't think the canoe is relevant.
They have very narrow bows, where it's also very wet.
It's notable that their forestays are set well back from the bow.
The kind of racing they are optimised for is probably quite different from the kind of club racing where a chute in front  of the stay scores because we tend to hoist and drop on both tacks.
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