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World Sailing Report on Bora Gulari Accident

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Do Different View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Do Different Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 17 at 10:22am
Two issues IGRF. I agree accidental wraps can be terrifying and potentially fatal but the incident in question was intentional.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 17 at 10:24am
Originally posted by iGRF

I don't, but 'they' have a habit of wrapping themselves around me, my legs mainly, about which I have a childhood phobia, when something wrapped itself round my legs when I was young swimming in the Thames at Oxford it held me under and I came very close to drowning.
I can't count the number of times I've completely lost the plot because of bloody ropes wrapping themselves where they are not wanted.


Iíve always had similar issues- itís funny, the good guys always seem to keep their sheets tidy, itís not dinghy sailing unless at least one tail has been lost down the self bailer... as for windsurfing, getting the mouse tail of the downhaul to stay in the sail pocket... píah, such complexity eludes me.

Edited by turnturtle - 23 Nov 17 at 10:25am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 17 at 10:28am
DoDifferent, I completely agree, the answer is to not wrap a rope. 

All my coaches said never wrap sheets. Partly for safety, but also it leads to a bad habit of keeping sheets still. 

Having said that, just looking at my 200 videos and if the main is near centre I pretty much always have a wrap (especially when sailing bare handed). I run a 6mm mainsheet, I guess it's just too thin for me to properly grip for the leech tension without gripper gloves. 

So why don't I wear gripper gloves?  Well, I'm guilty of another bad practice,  I like to slip the sheet through my hand to ease it, which is more difficult with a 'gripper' glove. I end up sailing most of the time without gloves so I can slip a sheet, but then then also wrap the sheet. 

So I was thinking, maybe I should start sailing with the sticky gripper gloves again as it'll at least force me to use better technique, and if I can get ones that are cut resistant and function just as well, then that's got to be good right? 

Regarding the gloves, what would be interesting to know, is whether the rope cut through his gloves and fingers, or if it just gripped his fingers through the gloves and pulled the fingers off alongside the rest of the glove. Because if his fingers tore off, but the glove didn't tear, just slipping off his hand, then  stronger gloves would not help. 

If the rope is gripping the fingers through the glove, then tearing both glove fingers and actual fingers off in one, then maybe Kevlar reinforced gloves may help? Your finger would still be gripped (possibly dislocation / break) but the strength of the glove would stop it being torn off (assuming the whole gloves doesn't slip off your hand taking your finger with it)? 



Edited by mozzy - 23 Nov 17 at 10:38am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote A2Z Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 17 at 10:56am
Maybe rules should state minimum of 8mm lines? Not trendy, not quite as free running, but possibly safer?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote andymck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 17 at 11:36am
There is a major floor in the report which is the lack of a good medical report. There are three potential mechanisms for the injury as described, a cut by a sharp surface. A crush injury by the control line or a ďringĒ avulsion type injury, which is a combination of constriction and tension. Or a combination. Use of Gloves will not really protect against the latter two. In fact can in some circumstances can make it worse.
A better description of the state of tissues at time of presentation including the state of the gloves would provide clues to the mechanism involved. This would normally be part of a medical report. This would have also tried to identify the mechanism as it does have a bearing on prognosis.
The big lesson appears to be the wrapping of sheets and lines.
Oh and that we know as we get faster and foil we are going to have more significant and potentially life changing injuries due to the massive increase in kinetic energy.

Andy

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Old Timer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 17 at 1:13pm
Originally posted by iGRF



Yotties should leave speed to the disciplines geared for it or design better safety systems.

.

Yeah, kiting is really safe, although I have heard tales of a few muppets smashing themselves up on land when they donít have the skills to control the kite. 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sargesail Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 17 at 1:55pm
In the early days I saw someone transition off the sea, over the beach and through the windscreen of his own BMW in the carpark.   LOL Clap
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Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Nov 17 at 5:23pm
I saw a kite mowdown two toddlers and their mother, they were paddling in two inches of water.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote johnr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 17 at 9:19am
Kit injury 1: guys loses control of his kite in car park is dragged along car park feet first with legs under parked car and face and body through car door. Poor guy reading the paper to get away from his wife on a Sunday morning probably had a toilet accident. Both kneecaps damaged and serious rehabilitation required.

Kite injury 2: Jumps and lands in massive tree stump washed up on beach breaking hip again with long term rehabilitation.

Kite injury 3: Fatality due to head injury colliding with slip edge during launching. The guys was a very experienced windsurfer, outdoor instructor and the last guy I thought would die doing kitesurfing.

Kiting does not seem that safe compared to windsurfing. Sure kit is better and people more skillful but the early adoptors did not seem to fare to well.

Not sure any of those gloves would prevent a reoccurrence of Bora's injury as I believe that it was the wrapping of the control line that caused the issue. It could be argued that if he was not wearing gloves then he would have come of without losing figures as the rope would have been more inclined to release. They are wearing gloves so they can pull high loads and use skinny ropes.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov 17 at 12:11pm
I heard a rumour of a muppet who smashed himself up on a harbour wall kiting.... he gave it up and Ďretiredí to dinghy sailing as a result... via a Musto Skiff.
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