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Another breezy one - another spanking.

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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 9:51am
Dinghies tried the wishbone boom on several boats, partly to get rid of the kicker, partly because they were trying to jump on the windsurfing band wagon.

Up to a point, it worked, but with only outhaul (by raising and lowering the boom on the mast), very simple cunningham and aft mainsheet to control things, it was pretty much impossible to fine tune the sail to the weather once the breeze was up. Given the amount of time I spend fiddling with kicker tension in boats with unstayed masts, it isn't surprising that the wishbone rig was really only good as a play boat, not for serious racing.
Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Leader, Topper 44496, yellow Minisail
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iGRF View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 11:20am
tbh I never saw the point of dinghies using wishbones other than for economy, but naturally I have to refute the suggestion that our far far far more sophisticated rigs are only good as 'play' boat fodder.

If you had spent as much time with both as I am becoming increasingly acquainted, then you'd realise what you're missing. Complex isn't always best, if something can be achieved with fewer controls then surely that's better, especially if the control is more effective.

Less to frig around with = more time focussing on the important things, which to me have always been elsewhere than the equipment.
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 11:59am
I'm not sure the 80's soft windsurfer style rig on the Tonic was what I'd call sophisticated. I did put a decent windsurfer sail and mast on at one point, but the clew height was far too far up to attach the mainsheet to, really, and I wasn't in a position to get a sail specially made. The other problem was the downhaul pressure needed, too - the hull couldn't have taken it. Was fun experimenting, though.
Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Leader, Topper 44496, yellow Minisail
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iGRF View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 12:34pm
No more than the 70's soft Laser style rig is today, the difference is, windsurfing long since ceased insulting it's consumer base with such anachronisms.
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 12:38pm

Makes the Laser sail look pretty OK...

But I do agree with what you mean. Mind, the way the windsurfer sail has developed isn't really the answer for dinghies, and I think the fully battened square top rigs on many very fast dinghies isn't the way for slower boats, either.
Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Leader, Topper 44496, yellow Minisail
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iGRF View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 3:51pm
Illustration of my last Raceboard sail, 9.5 sq mtr, cuben fibre weighed 2.7 kgs and the illustration shows the various amounts of twist including a little hook the leech feature in the head for very light wind and pump response.
The day I see a dinghy sail with that much range, I'll raise my coffin lid and turn over.



Edited by iGRF - 04 Feb 14 at 3:52pm
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 8:04pm
if there's one regret for selling the Solo, it was not taking enough photos of that HD Sail... honestly the perfect symbiosis of art and science, an utterly lovely product- and has really made me question ever buying another sail for any board or boat from a sweatshop brand ever again.

I'll admit to being tempted to join in on the D-One fun, but not whilst the sailmaker is restricted.  It's big no now for me.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote laser193713 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Feb 14 at 5:57pm
I echo the comments on kicker... its primary function in a boat like the EPs is not leech tension but mast bend. The sail is cut with both luff curve and broadseam to create its shape. The way to flatten that sail is to take the component of the shape which is created by the luff curve out of the sail. Pulling the kicker on really hard, I mean really hard, will bend the mast and flatten the sail. Once this is on hard then pull the Cunningham on hard to open the leech of the sail.

I am surprised you haven't realised this before from your experience in the 100 where in 90% of the conditions you pulled the kicker on to the absolute max and in some cases wished you could pull it even harder. Perhaps that's where you were going wrong with that boat too? What purchase do you have on your control lines on the EPs. A standard laser uses a 15:1 kicker and up to an 8:1 Cunningham. When it is windy even the biggest of laser sailor can be seen sat in the bottom of the boat with their feet against the front of the cockpit using their legs to squat the Cunningham tight. It really takes that much force sometimes!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Feb 14 at 6:27pm
You physically couldn't put that much tension using the current controls, they are so badly positioned if the racks are not out, which they're not at the moment cos they're jammed and tbh the Gnav doesn't look the sturdiest bit of kit. And no I certainly never applied that much of anything, kicker or downhaul to the RS100.
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laser193713 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote laser193713 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Feb 14 at 7:09pm
Sounds like that's why you struggled so much in that first nationals we did then! I couldn't pull enough of everything on! Get the racks fixed and let us know how much purchase you are running and we might be able to help further...
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