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Four races done

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Post Options Post Options   Quote NickM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 13 at 5:23pm
Oracle's dramatically improved performance upwind shows that the teams are still working out how best to sail these boats.   Fascinating to see if either side comes up with some other unexpected tweaks.
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getafix View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 13 at 9:41pm
Originally posted by Jack Sparrow

very magnanimous of you.

will you change your mind again when / if the tide is on the Flood next time and the course becomes single lane traffic only?!

Nope, don't think I'll need to, the change has less to do with specific tidal or wind directional changes and much more to do with tactical aggression and improved technique.  Technique comes with practice, as far as tactical aggression goes, I wouldn't t like to bet that Sir Ben and Msrs Spithill and Slingsby are going to run out any time soon 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote ohFFsake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 13 at 12:23am
Seriously eating my words about this whole AC72 thing. I was totally convinced that the series would be a straight drag race but have been totally glued to every race so far, and they seem to get closer and more exciting each time.

Biggest shame is that OTUSA conceded so many races before they found form. From here it would seem that if the boats stay evenly matched and the racing close then ETNZ will close it out within the next few races, simply by playing the percentages. On the other hand if either boat gains a substantial advantage then the racing won't be exciting. Either way it doesn't seem likely that we'll see another 9 races played out like the last two!

Been some interesting learning for all of us, trying to get to grips with concepts like "wing wash", and lead boats being able to cover the boat behind on the run?. Another thing that seems strange is the notion of crew members grinding apparently randomly, without a corresponding winch drum turning anywhere. For a while I thought BA's coffee grinder was there just to aid his thought processes

Interesting how Ray Davies seemed almost dismissive about Oracle beating them by picking the shifts better, as though that somehow nullified their achievement. To me the whole point of putting arguably 3 of the best shift-pickers in the sport at the back of the boat is to ensure you do just that to beat the other boat.

Reaching starts seemed like a drag race format in the AC45 fleet racing, but with just two boats it becomes as tactical as you like. Spithill's start in Race 9 was a joy to watch.

Great hearing some of the onboard stuff too. My favourite was the exchange between BA and JS, when BA complimented JS on good tacking, JS starts to explain what he's doing differently and BA politely tells him to shut up and sail the boat. I think at that point he came of age as a tactician!!!

Still have major concerns about the safety considerations though. Restricting the max wind strength ensures that the chase boats can keep up at all times, but I still wouldn't fancy the chances of any crew on the windward hull of a capsized AC72. Do you take your chances with a 60 foot jump and hope that you don't hit anything on the way down, or wait and hope the rig doesn't collapse so you fall the same distance with the boat on top? Can't really see an answer to that one...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 13 at 6:17am
Originally posted by ohFFsake



Still have major concerns about the safety considerations though. Restricting the max wind strength ensures that the chase boats can keep up at all times, but I still wouldn't fancy the chances of any crew on the windward hull of a capsized AC72. Do you take your chances with a 60 foot jump and hope that you don't hit anything on the way down, or wait and hope the rig doesn't collapse so you fall the same distance with the boat on top? Can't really see an answer to that one...


this may well be the only time we ever see the AC72's go at it, from both a safety and cost point-of-view I can't see them being the weapon of choice again, as the very good post on wings vs sails states above, as well know the last time one of these suffered a major capsize, a very good sailor was lost...shouldn't happen ever again


Edited by getafix - 17 Sep 13 at 6:19am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote GybeFunny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 13 at 6:40am
Originally posted by ohFFsake

Seriously eating my words about this whole AC72 thing. I was totally convinced that the series would be a straight drag race but have been totally glued to every race so far, and they seem to get closer and more exciting each time.

Biggest shame is that OTUSA conceded so many races before they found form. From here it would seem that if the boats stay evenly matched and the racing close then ETNZ will close it out within the next few races, simply by playing the percentages. On the other hand if either boat gains a substantial advantage then the racing won't be exciting. Either way it doesn't seem likely that we'll see another 9 races played out like the last two!

Been some interesting learning for all of us, trying to get to grips with concepts like "wing wash", and lead boats being able to cover the boat behind on the run?. Another thing that seems strange is the notion of crew members grinding apparently randomly, without a corresponding winch drum turning anywhere. For a while I thought BA's coffee grinder was there just to aid his thought processes

Interesting how Ray Davies seemed almost dismissive about Oracle beating them by picking the shifts better, as though that somehow nullified their achievement. To me the whole point of putting arguably 3 of the best shift-pickers in the sport at the back of the boat is to ensure you do just that to beat the other boat.

Reaching starts seemed like a drag race format in the AC45 fleet racing, but with just two boats it becomes as tactical as you like. Spithill's start in Race 9 was a joy to watch.

Great hearing some of the onboard stuff too. My favourite was the exchange between BA and JS, when BA complimented JS on good tacking, JS starts to explain what he's doing differently and BA politely tells him to shut up and sail the boat. I think at that point he came of age as a tactician!!!

Still have major concerns about the safety considerations though. Restricting the max wind strength ensures that the chase boats can keep up at all times, but I still wouldn't fancy the chances of any crew on the windward hull of a capsized AC72. Do you take your chances with a 60 foot jump and hope that you don't hit anything on the way down, or wait and hope the rig doesn't collapse so you fall the same distance with the boat on top? Can't really see an answer to that one...


I believe the sailors all wear harnesses with self lowering gear which means they can clip onto something and abseil down rather than having to jump. I think this was stipulated under the safety rules after the Artemis tragedy.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 13 at 9:27am
An abseiling line sounds like another thing to be trapped by? lesser evil, I guess.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ohFFsake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Sep 13 at 7:20pm
Originally posted by Rupert

An abseiling line sounds like another thing to be trapped by? lesser evil, I guess.


It all sounds very Wallace and Gromit
Be just my luck to find the line was too short and be left dangling 20 feet up!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 13 at 12:06pm
Originally posted by ohFFsake

Seriously eating my words about this whole AC72 thing. I was totally convinced that the series would be a straight drag race but have been totally glued to every race so far, and they seem to get closer and more exciting each time.

Biggest shame is that OTUSA conceded so many races before they found form. From here it would seem that if the boats stay evenly matched and the racing close then ETNZ will close it out within the next few races, simply by playing the percentages. On the other hand if either boat gains a substantial advantage then the racing won't be exciting. Either way it doesn't seem likely that we'll see another 9 races played out like the last two!

Been some interesting learning for all of us, trying to get to grips with concepts like "wing wash", and lead boats being able to cover the boat behind on the run?. Another thing that seems strange is the notion of crew members grinding apparently randomly, without a corresponding winch drum turning anywhere. For a while I thought BA's coffee grinder was there just to aid his thought processes

Interesting how Ray Davies seemed almost dismissive about Oracle beating them by picking the shifts better, as though that somehow nullified their achievement. To me the whole point of putting arguably 3 of the best shift-pickers in the sport at the back of the boat is to ensure you do just that to beat the other boat.

Reaching starts seemed like a drag race format in the AC45 fleet racing, but with just two boats it becomes as tactical as you like. Spithill's start in Race 9 was a joy to watch.

Great hearing some of the onboard stuff too. My favourite was the exchange between BA and JS, when BA complimented JS on good tacking, JS starts to explain what he's doing differently and BA politely tells him to shut up and sail the boat. I think at that point he came of age as a tactician!!!

Still have major concerns about the safety considerations though. Restricting the max wind strength ensures that the chase boats can keep up at all times, but I still wouldn't fancy the chances of any crew on the windward hull of a capsized AC72. Do you take your chances with a 60 foot jump and hope that you don't hit anything on the way down, or wait and hope the rig doesn't collapse so you fall the same distance with the boat on top? Can't really see an answer to that one...
This.

I caught up last night, it being breadknife in control of TV night, very exciting and for once the commentary wasn't too lame, it makes the concept of sailing cats almost palatable, need to brush up on the rules that are in play these days, there was stuff going on that used to be illegal (footing off on starboard to push them down further, that didn't used to be permitted)and the establishing of a windward overlap approaching from the rear, has that changed or is it specific to this series?
Very enthralling made me want to Foil up the Twin.


And the Kiwis lost when they left the old guy ashore - loved that bit..

Edited by iGRF - 18 Sep 13 at 12:09pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 13 at 12:17pm
Graeme see the dial down thread in the rules section... one to hit MaxiB with at the FOM.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ohFFsake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 13 at 10:51pm
"It's not over!"

...but somewhere off-stage I'm sure I can hear a fat lady clearing her throat...
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